Catherine Langman:
Welcome back to the show, Ben. It’s fantastic to have you back.
Ben Elliott:
Thanks for getting me back. I think that’s the biggest compliment someone can get is being invited back on to a podcast, so I appreciate it.
Catherine Langman:
Absolutely. And I really, really felt like it was time to have you back on the show, but it’s been such a bananas year. I don’t really know a better way to describe it at this point. A lot of people have had some crazy growth in their businesses. Other people, not so much, things have not gone to plan. A lot of people are really just exhausted and probably on the verge of burnout. We’re going to have a bit of a chat about all of that and maybe give people a few tips and tricks about how to try and take a little bit of time out and recharge for 2022. Sound good?
Ben Elliott:
Sounds good. Yeah, I love it. Sounds good, yeah, good.
Catherine Langman:
Yeah. I know you know a number of people in my community, as well as working with people all over the world, what’s your sense of this? Is it burnout that people are really struggling with? It’s just this real exhaustion, but mentally, as well as physically, that some people seem to be struggling with at the moment.
Ben Elliott:
Yeah. Well, it’s funny, I work with clients from across, what is it, eight different countries nowadays, so I see people from different cultures and everything, but it’s all the same story. And the negativity in the news and the negativity in the world and the stress it’s put on business and just everyone, it’s been hectic. I’m a person that I actually had burnout, I think, twice, actually proper medically diagnosed by the age of, I think, 23 years old, and the first time was just because I was doing everything and I was doing it too much and I was doing it wrongly. That’s just inexperience. And then, the second time all the burnout really came from just the stress and the negativity and the worry that was in my head all the time.
Ben Elliott:
I was constantly stressing and achieving, pushing myself and beating myself up in my head and worrying about things I can’t control, and that was a really bad spiral, and that’s the kind of burnout I think we’re seeing with a lot of people this year. There’s been a lot of external negativity, a lot of uncertainty, and it’s created this pattern of stress and worry. And when things go wrong that they can’t control, it’s just added that extra fuel to that fire. And I think that’s the kind of burnout that a lot of people have been facing more so this year, no matter the country really, it’s been like that worldwide really.
Catherine Langman:
Yeah, totally, totally. What do we do? It’s one thing to try and restrain from being that perfectionist and high achiever who’s just going to flog themselves til they get to the end of that to-do list, but I think, yeah, I do see a lot of people really struggling to … lockdowns aren’t helping, I guess, but there’s this sense of, “I can’t control what’s happening to me and it’s really stressing me out.”
Ben Elliott:
Well, me, obviously, I’m the mindset guy, so I’m going to come from a mindset and performance point of view.
Catherine Langman:
Let’s do that.
Ben Elliott:
And this is the thing is I have a saying that, a lot of my clients will laugh when they hear this, but the problem is not the problem. That’s one of my main sayings. A lot of the times, when we face these challenges, we always say, “Okay, the problem is because of the lockdown. The problem is because this happened in the business,” or “The problem is the supply chain has been disrupted.” And the challenge is, is when we have a focus that “I can’t do anything about it because it’s an external problem,” we disarm ourselves in any creativity of how to solve that, and that, I think, is the big issue. A lot of people, they will have in this year, they’ll have that happy when mindset. And that, it’s like, “I’ll relax once this is all sorted and done,” or “I’ll feel happy when I’m over this part here.”
Ben Elliott:
But the goalpost this year will just keep moving and people have had to keep adjusting so that happy when mindset then never really comes and then they’re almost allowing their mind to be stressed by going, “No, no, no, it’s not my mindset. It’s not my reaction. It’s not my approach. It’s really these external factors.” And, again, with all the lockdowns and all of that, it’s super justifiable to be in that place, no one’s going to criticize you for feeling like that, but the problem is it’s not really what’s going to be the main solution. The problem is not the problem. The real problem is always how are we reacting to these things? That will give us a mindset focus where it’s more of a growth mindset.
Ben Elliott:
It gives our control back. It’s like, “Okay, there’s a supply chain issue. I can’t do anything about it. What’s the real problem? It’s my reaction to it. I have to find a way to remain in peace, remain calm, still find a way to make the business move forward,” and it becomes more of a question of how can we make things work versus just we’re getting hammered by the year. I think that’s the first thing is you have to really take that mindset approach, how am I reacting and what solutions can I focus on? I’d say that’s major. And the other thing is, when it comes to that happy when, and that second key would be, a lot of people, they’re delaying enjoying their life because they’re waiting for things to return to normal. You’ve heard a bit of that?
Catherine Langman:
Oh, I see it. That’s for sure.
Ben Elliott:
Yeah. When things are back to normal, then I’ll be happy and then I’ll be thankful and then I’ll be fulfilled, and the reality is your performance really will be heightened or really minimized, and that’s your productivity, that’s your discipline, that’s your creativity. That’s all that stuff. Your performance is going to be heightened when you’re enjoying the journey a lot more. And, when there are things that you can’t control happening, it places so much of an emphasis to look at what you can control.
Ben Elliott:
What you can control is do you have a date night in your calendar every single week? Do you have time booked in to hang out with your family? Do you have time booked in just for you for half a day a week or two hours a week or even 30 minutes, if you can’t find it, but there have to be things in your schedule where your big values, your big priorities in life, have to really be locked in first before the work goes in because, with all the challenges this year, there’s so much to look at, so much to learn, so much to innovate, so much to change, so much to figure out, the work just won’t stop this year. It’s one of those things, when battling burnout, you must really lock in that ideal week and then everything else goes in around it.
Catherine Langman:
Yeah. That ideal week exercise, that might be something that we could quickly run through here, because I know that, a few years ago, when you introduced it to me, I really loved it, and I just did some really simple things at the time. I walk my kids to school in the morning, I read a book before I go to bed, or whatever the things were that I just really needed to do to feel good every day. And they didn’t cost me anything, I just needed to make the time to do it, and it did make a difference. Let’s walk through that ideal week exercise because, probably, people are just rolling their eyes right now going, “Well, how can we have an ideal week when Omicron is going crazy and I don’t want to go through another lockdown,” blah, blah, blah.
Ben Elliott:
Yeah. But, again, and that’s what it comes down to is those things are super uncontrollable. They might be okay. It might get worse. We don’t actually know. And the main thing is, is we have to then, if there’s so much uncontrollable, we have to take control of what we can control and that’s why the ideal week is massive. The way to do it is really simple. You just have a piece of paper. You have Monday through to Sunday. My ideal week goes from 5:00 AM and then every hour increments right about down to 10:00 PM, which is bedtime, which should be bedtime in an ideal week, so that’s the 5:00 AM til 10. And what I’ll do is I’ll start going, “Okay, what is my main value and my main priorities in life?”
Ben Elliott:
If someone’s answer is saying, “Hey, it’s my family. It’s my partner, my kids. That’s my family. That’s my number one,” then what you need to do is that’s where you have to take that first and go, “Okay, what am I doing this week? What are one to two actions or one or two things that I’m going to do to make sure that area of life gets looked after?” For me and my wife, it’s every Tuesday night, it’s non-negotiable, it’s a date night. It doesn’t matter what people have demands of me, what work meetings might come up, it doesn’t matter what good opportunities will come up, it doesn’t matter who wants to hang out with me. Tuesday night, it’s non-negotiable. I won’t take a business phone call. I won’t reply to a business email. It just doesn’t happen. But what it means is, no matter how big the week is, a major value for my life is my marriage, that’s going to get looked after.
Ben Elliott:
Other things in there, as well, like I perform better when I’m healthy, so that means there’s a gym workout or a bike ride or a run, and that’s in there five days a week. Then that’ll go into the diary, and, for me, that’s going to be 7:00 AM most days, wake up, do some business stuff, get on top of that, then I’ll hit the gym and then that’s going to be 7:00 until 8:00, and that just gets mapped out in the diary.
Ben Elliott:
Then we start going into, let’s say, business stuff. And, when you’re running your own business, you have the freedom and the burden to manage your own time, but then it comes down to how can I chunk my time so, that way, the things that will move the needle will actually get done. And, for every business owner, there’s probably two, three, maybe four at max needle-movers that, if you get those tasks or those actions done or implemented, that’s what’s actually going to make a successful week. A lot of people are so tired and burnt out, but the things that they’re doing that are making them tired and burnt out aren’t bringing them closer to their vision.
Catherine Langman:
Yeah. It’s the busy-work that’s keeping you busy, but isn’t necessarily helping the business move forward, but we feel good because we’re keeping busy.
Ben Elliott:
Yeah. Yeah. But that’s the thing, at this time of year, you’ll be exhausted and you’ll look back at what you’ve accomplished and you’ll be a bit disappointed because there hasn’t been the growth there or there’s still those really important tasks that have been on your list. I think everyone should have, in their ideal week, what are those needle-movers? What are those two or three different activities?
Ben Elliott:
I’ll say a metaphor, it might help just to teach this, the needle-movers. The phrase needle-mover actually came from when they were recording instruments. Marcus might know a bit about that, what it is, a VU meter, a volume unit meter. And what they found back in the day was they’d have all the instruments playing, but there were some instruments that were so quiet that they wouldn’t even be recorded and they wouldn’t come up on the dial, so there wouldn’t be any volume units come through. There’s a lot of people who they’ll be so busy making a lot of noise, doing a lot of activity, but it won’t even move the needle at all for their business and for their success. We want to be really, really clear on those top three, top four, and, once they’re booked in, then you just to have to live by your diary.
Catherine Langman:
Yeah. For listeners’ perspective, Marcus is my husband. He’s a drummer. Yeah, he always shifted the needle recording. I think he got clocked by the neighbors at 120 decibels when he was a teenager, so he’s pretty good at making a lot of noise.
Ben Elliott:
Oh, wow. Yeah.
Catherine Langman:
But, yeah, I guess we want to be the drummer in our business. We want to be the one who’s really shifting the needle. Yeah, I like that. I like that a lot. And I know that there’s quite a few of the listeners in our community here who do classify themselves as Type A personalities. I always try and encourage them that they need to be recovering perfectionists, especially when working in digital world. We can’t be perfectionist about this kind of stuff, but we don’t want to have such an enormous to-do list that we feel like absolute crap by the end of the week because we didn’t even tick 5% of it off. Two or three things is enough and just-
Ben Elliott:
Hey, even if you just did one, if you were really pushing the limits of high performance and you feel like you have it in you, there’s no need to ever have more than one hard thing a day on your list, absolutely not, no way. Anything more than that, you are just not outsourcing enough or not hiring enough people, you know what I mean, or you’re controlling things too much instead of trusting them to other people on your team. You know that, but that’s a big thing.
Catherine Langman:
Yeah. I had to learn that hard way, didn’t I? That’s okay.
Ben Elliott:
Yeah. Sometimes easier said than done, but, again, yeah, again, [crosstalk 00:13:02].
Catherine Langman:
Yeah, 100%, 100%.
Ben Elliott:
Yeah. I’m going to say one more thing. Yeah. With those, we talk about Type A personalities, you would’ve heard it before, I’ve heard it a million times, those people who finally … they’ve booked it in, they had their ideal week, it’s date night or it’s time for themselves, they’re reading a book, they’re going for a walk, but then they feel guilty that they’re not working.
Catherine Langman:
Yeah. I see that.
Ben Elliott:
Yeah. That there will be a major source of burnout as well because, when they should be relaxing, they should be with the family, they should be by themselves, they should be recovering, their brain hasn’t switched off. Then, in that time, because they’re feeling guilty or stressing about what they haven’t done, they’re going to be releasing that adrenaline or that cortisol hormone into their system, which will burn them out. The amount of times where I’ve had a high-performing client’s [inaudible 00:13:48] us, they say, “When I lay down to fall asleep at night, my brain just won’t stop thinking about work,” it just shows me that, all day long, their brain has been on that one path the whole time, and that there is a real hindrance to your energy levels.
Ben Elliott:
Soon as your energy levels start dipping, you’re basically on a timer before things get worse and worse and worse. You can put up with being low energy for a few weeks, if you’re really resilient, a few months, but there’s a real danger to that. My strategy, if you are one of those people who just feels guilty in your switch-off time, you really need to mentally prepare yourself. Almost like an athlete would for a game, you need to mentally prepare yourself for your actual switch-off time, which sounds ridiculous, but you need to set a goal for your switch-off time or set a goal for date night.
Ben Elliott:
And it sounds funny to have a goal for date night, but, when I was that workaholic, didn’t realize I was a workaholic until I met Anna, and then she kindly revealed that to me, that I was always plugged in and working all the time in my head, but what I had to do, because I was really, really bad in this, I had to really just go, “Okay, I’m going to stop, date night’s coming up. Okay, what is my intention for date night? I just want to have a lot of laughs, lot of fun, a lot of chill.” And I’ll have that mental outcome in my head and it just helps my brain. instead of the goal, goal, goal of business, it’s the goal of date night and it helps your brain switch off and you still feel like you’re going in the right path, because the brain is a goal-seeking mechanism. It needs a new goal in order to switch off from a different goal temporarily.
Catherine Langman:
Yeah. That’s a really good point. I definitely think I would’ve been one of those people. I think, for me, when I moved to this place that we are in now and got a separate office … my office has always been separate, a room in the house, but it was there and I could see the door and so I was probably not mentally present a lot of the time that I was with my family, but now it’s completely not part of the house at all. It’s very, very separate, separate building, etc. And it’s great because it’s not right there in front of me and that’s definitely helped.
Catherine Langman:
I don’t know whether you said this to me a while back, but I’ve heard the saying that you’ve got to be present wherever you are. If it’s, mum time or family time or date night time or work time, just be there. Put your phone away, don’t be answering social media stuff or emails or anything like that when it’s family time and, vice versa, don’t be trying to deal with the kids when you are … easier said than done, I suppose, when it’s lockdown and you’re trying to juggle schooling, but, hopefully, we’ll have no more of that.
Ben Elliott:
Yeah, it’s funny. It’s one of the most important things. I think the biggest theme for listeners is we can talk about all these things and sometimes people will say, “Ben, you’re too organized,” but I’m like, “I’m probably the most go-with-the-flow person, but I’ve realized, if I’m not proactive, I just get swamped by life. I’ll be busy nonstop and all of that.” And what this really is about is it’s about, if you don’t steer your life, you’re just going to get swallowed up, and then you might recover from this burnout, but then it’ll probably happen again next year. And even if it’s not Omicron, it’ll be some other business issues that will then swallow you up and you’ll go through the same pattern. It is super key.
Catherine Langman:
It’s true.
Ben Elliott:
And that thing about being present is one of the most important things. It’s so simple, but it’s a game-changer when you can do it. I was the same. I was at the gym and I wanted to be working. And then, when I was working, I wanted to be walking on the beach, but then I’d be walking on the beach and then I’d be thinking about doing something else over here. And then it’s like you can do all of those things, but you’re not really there-
Catherine Langman:
Can’t do them all at once.
Ben Elliott:
… and it’s not a good way of living.
Catherine Langman:
No, it’s quite tiresome after a while, that’s for sure. Actually, another thing that I heard, I heard a podcast recently with Donald Miller, the StoryBrand author. I don’t know if anyone’s read that book, but, anyway, I was listening to him and he said that he did this exercise, just made it up himself, I think, that he wrote his own eulogy. And so this is more than your ideal week exercise really. It’s like he was listing out all the things he wanted to achieve in his life and what he wanted to be remembered for, and I went, “Wow, I’ve not thought that far ahead.” That’s pretty cool.
Ben Elliott:
Yeah, that’s big time. That could be confronting for a lot of people, but I think that would be a really good exercise. You have to find a way that’s going to get you off that hamster wheel, and getting that perspective, I think, will motivate a lot of people.
Catherine Langman:
Yeah, definitely. I guess the next thing that I really wanted to try and touch on, I guess from a mindset perspective, but something that, given the time of year … we’re recording this, it’s December and, obviously, it’s the time of year many of us in business are thinking about the year ahead and trying to work out what are we going to do next year, what are we planning for, what are our goals for the next year, are we going to be growing, are we going to be launching new products, etc. etc., and a lot of people are feeling very confused and resistant about trying to plan ahead because of the experiences that they’ve been through this year. Shall we dive into that topic a little bit?
Ben Elliott:
Yeah, sure, sure. The thing that immediately comes to mind, I’m a big fanboy of a few things. I’m really into the basketball. I’m really into Formula 1, thank you, Netflix-
Catherine Langman:
Oh, wow.
Ben Elliott:
… [crosstalk 00:19:34] series. That means my ideal week hasn’t really happened when the race have been on at 1:30 in the morning-
Catherine Langman:
That’s right.
Ben Elliott:
… but still good. Another thing that I’m a real fanboy of is just I love studying the mindset of soldiers and people in the military, and there’s this thing that, if you’re wanting to be an elite level soldier in the SAS or something like that in the UK, they have this first week of training where they basically sleep deprive you, give you no food, and it’s the whole selection to see if you are mentally and physically capable to be a part of their program. It’s a whole week where they’re just actually thinning out the herd of everyone who wants to be a part of it.
Ben Elliott:
At the end of the week, you’re sleep deprived, you’re hungry. You’ve been physically pushed to the limit. And then one of the last things that they’ll get them to do is this thing called the Fan Dance. There’s this massive, this really long, big, challenging hill or mountain or in Wales, and it’s a 24 kilometer march, but you have your full 40 kilo pack or whatever it is on your back the whole time and you have to be able to keep up with the instructor who doesn’t have the pack, and they’re walking, jogging, the whole time as well.
Catherine Langman:
Oh, my gosh.
Ben Elliott:
It’s completely load-bearing. You’re already tired. You’re already exhausted. You’re going through this really tough terrain and you’re fully exhausted and, in your mind, you’re thinking, “As long as I can just get to the end, then I’m done, I’m finished, and it’s all good.” A lot of people give up along the way, thinning out the pack. Then they’ll finally arrive at the other side of this massive mountain, they put their packs down, they’re exhausted-
Catherine Langman:
[crosstalk 00:21:15].
Ben Elliott:
… but what’s waiting there for them? Well, what’s waiting for them is a whole bunch of donuts and pastries and food that’s really sweet, really nice. They haven’t eaten for days properly, they’re sleep deprived, and they give them a choice, you either get to eat this food right now, which means you quit, or you can pack up your bag, turn around, and do it again and go back.
Catherine Langman:
Gosh.
Ben Elliott:
And that that’s that final test, and that’s really what they’re trying to do there is generate this task to see the resilience of people. And the reason why that stands out to me is a lot of people that’ve gone, “Okay. I just need to get through 2020,” and then, all of a sudden, the lockdowns come in 2021, and then, all of a sudden, “I just need to get through this.” And it’s almost like the minds of a lot of people have just been trying to go, “Just help me get through this, and then I’m good,” but then it’s like, “What, what … do I have to face all of that again?” And that puts a lot of dread and a lot of trepidation … and it really is the Fan Dance scenario, but in real life and in business here, and it really is a test of resolve and a test of resilience.
Ben Elliott:
But if we use the Fan Dance as a metaphor, if you’re going to be the person who’s not going to plan ahead, who’s going to sit on the sidelines and wait for everything to sort out, you’re probably not going to survive in business long term if you are taking that kind of approach, you know what I mean? You really do just need to go, “Okay, couple of moments, refresh, set the vision again, get motivated again, get clear again,” but you have to prepare yourself just to go at it again.
Ben Elliott:
There’s no success principle you’re going to find where they say, “You know what? The best thing you can do if it’s hard, just sit on the sideline for six months. Just don’t plan. Just don’t be organized. Just hope it works out.” It’s just not going to happen that way. You really just have to shake off the negativity and go, “You know what? There might be more delays in 2022.” There might not be, but you have to go, “Okay, what’s the plan?” And then it’s just about, again, the problem’s not the problem. If something happens, I have to focus on solutions, I have to reach out to the right mentors who have my back, the right people who can help me, and you just have to attack it again. There’s just no other way around it.
Catherine Langman:
Yeah. And I guess, also, not trying to approach planning from the perspective that I must get this right and, if I’m not going to get it right, then I’m not going to bother.
Ben Elliott:
Yeah. Yeah. The tree that bends doesn’t snap. Yeah, got to be flexible, got to adapt.
Catherine Langman:
Yeah. Aim for something, but, if things change, then we can pivot along the way.
Ben Elliott:
Absolutely, good point.
Catherine Langman:
Yeah. Geez, though, that terrible exercise.
Ben Elliott:
The Fan Dance? Yeah.
Catherine Langman:
[crosstalk 00:23:55] brutal.
Ben Elliott:
Yeah. I don’t know. It would be pretty tough not to take the donut.
Catherine Langman:
It would be very hard not to take the donut, that’s right. My listeners would’ve heard me talk about this before too, but my sons, who are competitive swimmers, they’re on school holidays already. They’re teenagers and they have a really big meet coming up this weekend. The whole weekend, they’ll be competing. And so they’re on school holidays already. They are training about 20 hours a week in the pool, gyms on top of that. My eldest son who’s 16, he came into speak to me the day after school broke up for the year, and he’s like, “Mom, I’ve deleted TikTok, I’ve deleted Snapchat, so I’m all in. I’m focused.” I’m like, “Wow.”
Ben Elliott:
What a gun. What a champion.
Catherine Langman:
And that’s following the black line hours, day in, day out, and you might shave a second off your time towards a very long-term goal. Yeah. It’s pretty amazing.
Ben Elliott:
Can I just point out something? There’s a principle there, I think. A lot of listeners would be like, “Wow, this young guy has such self-discipline and such self-control,” and we might hear that and think, “I don’t have that discipline and that self-control,” but I don’t know your son, but the principle usually is is that, when someone gets a really, really clear vision of what they’re trying to accomplish and they’re focused on that, that’s usually where discipline comes from. For him, what is his goal? Is he wanting to go pro, is he wanting to get a medal, is he really obsessed about getting his time down? What’s motivating him?
Catherine Langman:
His long-term goal is to be, ultimately, selected on the Australian team to compete, yeah, and that’s a very long-term goal, obviously, so he’s broken that down and he knows what times he really would like to get to at this meet, and then the next one, which it’ll be state championships and, yeah, they’re on over the next few years. Yeah, he’s worked it out, but he’s got this big goal. His father, my husband, he made it to Olympic trials and he got into a B final, and then he got really, really, really sick. We talk about burnout. He hit that burnout. He over-trained for a long period of time and got really, really, really sick. And then, by the time he’d finally recovered, it was a year-long recovery, he was really too old, so he missed his window of opportunity, which is … it’s a little bit disappointing. But that’s all right, he loves his music, so he’s all good. But, yeah, his sons, they just want to do what their dad didn’t quite manage.
Ben Elliott:
Yeah. Yeah. But I think there’s a whole bunch of keys in there, and I think, if you’re listening to this on the podcast and you’re relating to some of these things, I think the answers are really tied up in all of that there, because, with your son, he has such a big vision that’s really important to him and that’s where the self-discipline and the self-control and that’s where the deletion of TikTok is going to come from. And, for someone his age, in his teens, I think that’s a big deal.
Catherine Langman:
Oh, that’s huge.
Ben Elliott:
For me, at my age, I don’t care about TikTok, but for someone at that age it’s massive, right?
Catherine Langman:
It’s huge.
Ben Elliott:
Where does that discipline come from? It’s that clarity of vision. I think, if you’re struggling to plan for the new year, it really is about, okay, connect with your vision, what are you trying to achieve, how is it going to happen, but then I think we can also learn from your husband. He had the vision, but then it wasn’t sustainable. He pushed himself too hard. The discipline came from the vision, but he didn’t do things in a way where he probably didn’t have his downtime, his recovery time, I’m just guessing here, but that’s usually the cause of the burnout.
Catherine Langman:
No. Well, three times a day, he was training at that point, three times a day.
Ben Elliott:
Yeah, wow.
Catherine Langman:
Could you imagine your state of your skin? It’s a good thing I didn’t know him then. He would’ve smelled like chlorine nonstop.
Ben Elliott:
It would’ve been like cuddling sandpaper.
Catherine Langman:
Oh, it would be disgusting. I love that you’re talking about this big vision and I do think this is important here for everyone and a timely reminder for me too, because I’m doing this planning stuff now as well, but we can’t just be aiming for a 12-month goal because, when things get hard, it is really difficult to sustain the energy and the motivation. When it is a smaller goal, that smaller goal should be an incremental step towards something that you are trying to build towards.
Ben Elliott:
Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. And that’s where the ideal week then slides in behind it because then it has to be done in a way where you do the needle-movers. For your son, he knows the exercises, he knows the weights, he knows his needle-movers. But then also, for us in business, it’d be what are the main activities, the main tasks, and how can we do it in a way that’s sustainable, and the answer for that is how do we look after the other areas of life, health, downtime, family time, social time, whatever your values are-
Catherine Langman:
The things that-
Ben Elliott:
… and that there would be a really good combo. [crosstalk 00:28:59]?
Catherine Langman:
Oh, I was just going to say having the time in the week to do the things that keep you happy, even if it’s just reading a novel before you go to bed like I do.
Ben Elliott:
Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah, good.
Catherine Langman:
Super cool. I think this has been a great conversation. I’m really, really pleased you could squeeze a little bit of time in your calendar to join me on the show again today.
Ben Elliott:
Pleasure.
Catherine Langman:
And, before we wrap it up, share again where can people find out more about you if they want to connect with you?
Ben Elliott:
Yeah. The easiest way, just go to HighPerformanceUnlocked.com. That would be the easiest way to find me and all my three websites will be in there.
Catherine Langman:
And your fabulous new podcast as well, so I think everybody needs to go and tune into that if you need a little bit of holiday listening to try and lift your spirits over the coming holiday period.
Ben Elliott:
Yeah. I appreciate that. So the name of the podcast, it’s on all great podcast places, Spotify, Apple, all that kind of stuff, and it’s High Performance Unlocked with Ben Elliott. And, if you search for that, you’re going to be able to find it. There’ll be a really handsome gentleman on the photo there and that’ll be me and, yeah-
Catherine Langman:
Love it.
Ben Elliott:
… and there are some good episodes up there for you guys.
Catherine Langman:
There are, and we’ll share the links to all of that on our podcast show notes as well. And, hopefully, you guys can dig into that and enjoy it. But thank you again for joining us today, Ben. It’s been an absolute pleasure.
Ben Elliott:
Fantastic. Appreciate it. Thanks for the time.